tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post8844533971428120667..comments2024-03-15T05:40:28.017-07:00Comments on teresamerica: Historian David Barton -- Is America a Christian Nation?Teresahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-42239556663172959232010-08-30T18:32:44.571-07:002010-08-30T18:32:44.571-07:00This is re-posted after being deleted somehow.
Vi...This is re-posted after being deleted somehow.<br /><br />Video 1: a) American exceptionalism, de Tocqueville opined, is due to the *lack* of religiosity in our govt and the allowance of diversity. Barton completely turns his meaning around. Yes, Europe and elsewhere had undergone a lot of revolution in the 12th thru 16th centuries, and much of it was due to differences of opinion regarding religion, and the co-opting of religion by govts. Thus the founders made a point to keep it OUT of our govt.<br /><br />b)Andrew Jackson said the "Bible is the rock.." Jackson (Pres 1826-1837) was not a "founder", and he was wrong on this issue. <br /><br />Video 2 is irrelevant to the argument.<br /><br />Video 3. a) Barton talks about the Congressional Bible but fails to tell us that it was printed in 1782-- 5 yrs before the Constitution which certainly would have prohibited such funding. Similarly for the Treaty of Paris (1783). Barton also talks of the Old Deluder Act from the 1600's, which is irrelevant to our Constitution and even our founding. I did a search of my pdf of the Constitution (1789) and didn't find "God", "Jesus" or "Christ." Are these accidental omissions by our founders? <br /><br />b) Barton leaves out any mention the Treaty of Tripoli (1797), which begins: "As the Government of the United States...is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion..." (Reference Two, below). Why did Barton leave this out? Methinks he has an agenda here.<br /><br />Video 4. a) Barton continues his summary of Christians who were involved in the founding-- they all apparently forgot to include Jesus Christ in the Constitution. Even the Declaration uses "Creator" and Providence in rather generic terminology. I think this is even more telling about the founders beliefs of govt vs religion. They had seen how govts co-opt belief systems for their own cynical reasons, therefore every attempt was made to separate religion from govt.<br /><br />b.) He says one thing at 7:00 on video 4 about how we should be tolerant of other faiths because the "truth will win out"; perhaps we should tell this to the 71% mostly Christians who think the GZ Islamic Center is a threat.<br /><br />c). By Barton's standard, since I attended sectarian schools, I would be considered a devout Catholic. We need to be careful to separate these founders' schooling (almost all schools were affiliated with churches in the Anglican colonies) from the individual's supernatural beliefs, or lack thereof.<br /><br />Video 5. The first line says, "We are told that the signers of the Declaration are the enemies of Christ..." WTF? Is that the mother of all straw man arguments, or what? Who said the signers called Christ the "Enemy"? Now he's just trying to appeal to emotion, to incite the crowd...he lost what little credibility he had left at that moment.<br /><br />Conclusion: the signers lived in a time of raucus political and religious debate, but they were prescient in realizing that we cannot know the intentions of God or even if one exists. Sure, some were Christians, but they did not prescribe that belief system on our nation. To say differently would be the equivalent of blasphemy. Just because a lot of cardiologists drive German sports cars does not imply that cardiologists are recommending German sports cars for better heart health. Sports cars just appeal to them.<br /><br />The most significant thing about our founding is the lack of religiosity in many of these documents and correspondence. It's almost as if Franklin, Jefferson, Madison, et al, predicted the scientific revolution, Darwinism, the value of secularism, etc. <br /><br />Two references: <a href="http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/feature/2009/04/14/christian_nation" rel="nofollow">One</a> and <a href="http://www.thenation.com/article/our-godless-constitution" rel="nofollow">Two.</a>Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03056377038486402824noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-23269393583727263262010-08-26T13:28:18.253-07:002010-08-26T13:28:18.253-07:00LOL, probably divine intervention!LOL, probably divine intervention!Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03056377038486402824noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-46026961926294736092010-08-26T13:26:49.020-07:002010-08-26T13:26:49.020-07:00Tony,
For some reason your comment only showed...Tony,<br /> For some reason your comment only showed up in my inbox, of both email addresses. I don't know why but anyways....<br /><br />Thank you for stopping by and commenting. I will respond to your comment soon.Teresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-48647243045939706152010-08-26T09:21:55.699-07:002010-08-26T09:21:55.699-07:00Video 1: a) American exceptionalism, many think, i...Video 1: a) American exceptionalism, many think, is due to the *lack* of religiosity in our govt. Yes, Europe and elsewhere had undergone a lot of revolution in the 12th thru 16th centuries, and much of it was due to differences of opinion regarding religion, and the co-opting of religion by govts. Thus the founders made a point to keep it OUT of our govt.<br /><br />b)Andrew Jackson said the "Bible is the rock.." Jackson (Pres 1826-1837) was not a "founder", and he was wrong on this issue. <br /><br />Video 2 is irrelevant to the argument.<br /><br />Video 3. a) Barton talks about the Congressional Bible but fails to tell us that it was printed in 1782-- 5 yrs before the Constitution which certainly would have prohibited such funding. Similarly for the Treaty of Paris (1783). Barton also talks of the Old Deluder Act from the 1600's, which is irrelevant to our Constitution and even our founding. I did a search of my pdf of the Constitution (1789) and didn't find "God", "Jesus" or "Christ." Are these accidental omissions by our founders? <br /><br />b) Barton leaves out any mention the Treaty of Tripoli (1797), which begins: "As the Government of the United States...is not in any sense founded on the Christian religion..." (Reference Two, below). Why did Barton leave this out? Methinks he has an agenda here.<br /><br />Video 4. a) Barton continues his summary of Christians who were involved in the founding-- they all apparently forgot to include Jesus Christ in the Constitution. Even the Declaration uses "Creator" and Providence in rather generic terminology. I think this is even more telling about the founders beliefs of govt vs religion. They had seen how govts co-opt belief systems for their own cynical reasons, therefore every attempt was made to separate religion from govt.<br /><br />b.) He says one thing at 7:00 on video 4 about how we should be tolerant of other faiths because the "truth will win out"; perhaps we should tell this to the 71% mostly Christians who think the GZ Islamic Center is a threat.<br /><br />c). By Barton's standard, since I attended sectarian schools, I would be considered a devout Catholic. We need to be careful to separate these founders' schooling (almost all schools were affiliated with churches in the Anglican colonies) from the individual's supernatural beliefs, or lack thereof.<br /><br />Video 5. The first line says, "We are told that the signers of the Declaration are the enemies of Christ..." WTF? Is that the mother of all straw man arguments, or what? Who said the signers called Christ the "Enemy"? Now he's just trying to appeal to emotion, to incite the crowd...he lost what little credibility he had left at that moment.<br /><br />Conclusion: the signers lived in a time of raucus political and religious debate, but they were prescient in realizing that we cannot know the intentions of God or even if one exists. Sure, some were Christians, but they did not prescribe that belief system on our nation. To say differently would be the equivalent of blasphemy. Just because a lot of cardiologists drive German sports cars does not imply that cardiologists are recommending German sports cars for better heart health. Sports cars just appeal <i>to them.</i><br /><br />The most significant thing about our founding is the lack of religiosity in many of these documents and correspondence. It's almost as if Franklin, Jefferson, Madison, et al, predicted the scientific revolution, Darwinism, the value of secularism, etc. <br /><br />Two references: <a href="http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/feature/2009/04/14/christian_nation" rel="nofollow">One</a> and <a href="http://www.thenation.com/article/our-godless-constitution" rel="nofollow">Two.</a>Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03056377038486402824noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-48162881177169880762010-02-27T13:10:19.196-08:002010-02-27T13:10:19.196-08:00Yes, Terasa is right again. The Left lives with re...Yes, Terasa is right again. The Left lives with religions such as "Global Warming" or "Political Correctness". I am not an expert but I in belief that Judeo-CHristian law, reason and faith are based on the direct Word of God, have a huge influence on our Country. As it should. Too bad our White House is not into Christianity but are into ???Stop Marxismhttp://notyrants.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-34082782821488233452010-02-27T09:01:19.435-08:002010-02-27T09:01:19.435-08:00Joe,
You are absolutely correct. These Libs ce...Joe,<br /> You are absolutely correct. These Libs certainly like to spread falsehoods with their revisionist history. We are very much a country founded on Judeo Christian principles.Teresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-30256882447070792982010-02-27T08:59:29.777-08:002010-02-27T08:59:29.777-08:00Opie,
That is an interesting fact. Thanks.Opie,<br /> That is an interesting fact. Thanks.Teresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-47710751671279161092010-02-27T08:58:44.205-08:002010-02-27T08:58:44.205-08:00Fuzzy,
YES, America is a Judeo Christian nat...Fuzzy,<br /> YES, America is a Judeo Christian nation. Its the Lefties who want to forget our past, impose revisionist history on others, and "remake" America to make it into some socialist Godless, immoral nation.Teresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-75669312245194788262010-02-27T08:55:21.361-08:002010-02-27T08:55:21.361-08:00Jonathan Rowe,
You only wish it was crap. The ...Jonathan Rowe,<br /> You only wish it was crap. The number is correct. Here is a great explanation: http://ourfoundingtruth.blogspot.com/2007/10/founding-fathers-considered-clergy.html<br /><br />Thanks for proving how much you Lefties live in a fantasy land while we conservatives live in reality and facts.Teresahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16040553825059591114noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-23805168911175025972010-02-27T08:29:16.435-08:002010-02-27T08:29:16.435-08:00The seminary degrees figure is crap.
Only one sig...The seminary degrees figure is crap.<br /><br />Only one signer of the DOI -- John Witherspoon -- was a minister.Jonathan Rowehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04079637406589278386noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-9764647171228999262010-02-27T07:34:18.216-08:002010-02-27T07:34:18.216-08:00Many of our New England founders had large librari...Many of our New England founders had large libraries and a diversity of books, yet they thought it important that the Bible be taught in public schools.<br /><br />We were founded upon Judeo/Christian principles. Anyone who thinks or says otherwise has not read the works of the founders; only the works of those who would twist what the founders actually said.Joehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09693381971064363612noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-29831747483232430742010-02-27T05:11:02.978-08:002010-02-27T05:11:02.978-08:00Many pioneers could not lug books across the conti...Many pioneers could not lug books across the continent, so the Bible was a large portion of their reading.Opus #6https://www.blogger.com/profile/02063785617333740178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1075932024272546688.post-62347886477251091052010-02-27T01:18:48.814-08:002010-02-27T01:18:48.814-08:00I haven't watched all of these, but I will! T...I haven't watched all of these, but I will! The first one was great, and the answer is YES! American is a (Judeo-)Christian nation.Fuzzy Slippershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13021615731454709413noreply@blogger.com